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Old December 26th, 2012, 08:06 PM   #91
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Paul is right, they aren't good for lowered cars DD as it the j series frames sit very low on the ground.

I'm using a modified steel subframe that relocated the steering rack, and modified suspension mounting points for improved bump steer and suspension geometry/roll center. All my subframe bushings are also solid. And parts of the subframe have Been cut off for weight reduction as well.
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Old December 27th, 2012, 08:55 AM   #92
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<<<< Thinks about keeping accord now
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Old December 27th, 2012, 11:32 AM   #93
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^Now with this you could properly tune for E85, get the power out of it without melting down your engine.
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Old December 27th, 2012, 12:03 PM   #94
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^Now with this you could properly tune for E85, get the power out of it without melting down your engine.
Do you think that Ethans piggy back that he is making/made will also be capable od running e85 and bigger injectors?

E85 around me is 3.26/gal right now
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Old December 27th, 2012, 01:19 PM   #95
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It takes about 40% more ethanol to make the same power you would get our of traditional gasoline. Unless your fuel system is plumbed for that duty capacity I don't recommend it. If you do however plan on running ethanol on a race car, buy from Sunoco. Not from the pump.

The advantage is cooler combustion but that had to do with the extra fuel needed. That's why you see in major racing that use ethanol they pit way more for fuel now than they use to.

Race gas does the same thing. Cost more though but burns more efficient.
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Old December 31st, 2012, 08:48 PM   #96
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Started making an excel sheet to compare pin outs. Knighthawk does your ecu use 4 or 5 plugs and if 4 which connectors? If I remember right my accord on has 4 plugs.
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Old January 7th, 2013, 10:52 AM   #97
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Well todays the day friends. Lets look forward to seeing good results. Cheers!
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Old January 7th, 2013, 08:09 PM   #98
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I am not a Pro Turner or even have a good grasp on Tunning Vehicles. Could someone please tell me why this TL-S ECU + Harness + Flash Pro etc. Is better then the AEM FIC ?

Would they come out to the same price?
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Old January 7th, 2013, 08:17 PM   #99
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I am not a Pro Turner or even have a good grasp on Tunning Vehicles. Could someone please tell me why this TL-S ECU + Harness + Flash Pro etc. Is better then the AEM FIC ?

Would they come out to the same price?
The AEM FIC is like a piggy back, and manipulates the stock ECU to output the parameters that are more desirable. It does this by changing the signals and inputting the parameters that it thinks will result in the desired output.

With Hondata, you are taking an ECU and instead of manipulating it, you are rewriting the parameters so it ALWAYS outputs the values you want your motor to run at. There are many other parameters you can control with this as well, not just AFR, and Timing Advance but tons of different tables. This gives full access to everything we need to make the most power and guarantee it will run the motor the way we need it to.
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Old January 7th, 2013, 08:27 PM   #100
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The AEM FIC is like a piggy back, and manipulates the stock ECU to output the parameters that are more desirable. It does this by changing the signals and inputting the parameters that it thinks will result in the desired output.

With Hondata, you are taking an ECU and instead of manipulating it, you are rewriting the parameters so it ALWAYS outputs the values you want your motor to run at. There are many other parameters you can control with this as well, not just AFR, and Timing Advance but tons of different tables. This gives full access to everything we need to make the most power and guarantee it will run the motor the way we need it to.
So.. Should I buy a TL-S ECU now?
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Old January 7th, 2013, 08:30 PM   #101
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You should wait
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Old January 8th, 2013, 05:40 PM   #102
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The AEM FIC is like a piggy back, and manipulates the stock ECU to output the parameters that are more desirable. It does this by changing the signals and inputting the parameters that it thinks will result in the desired output.

With Hondata, you are taking an ECU and instead of manipulating it, you are rewriting the parameters so it ALWAYS outputs the values you want your motor to run at. There are many other parameters you can control with this as well, not just AFR, and Timing Advance but tons of different tables. This gives full access to everything we need to make the most power and guarantee it will run the motor the way we need it to.
Amazing response!!! exactly what I was looking for. Thanks!!!!
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Old January 8th, 2013, 06:39 PM   #103
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In regards to the automatic transmission:

I need to use an A/T cause I am paraplegic.
What is the opinion on using an external A/T controller with the set up? ....do-able or no?




** I'm guessing if one could make it work, somehow, someway... the function within the ECU for shifting the tranny would need to be disabled (if possible) so there is no conflict between the ECU trying to shift and the A/T controller trying to do it's thing.
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Old January 16th, 2013, 06:26 PM   #104
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Can't remember if this was asked already...with this could we also adjust our redlines higher if we got better springs/retainers ect?
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Old January 16th, 2013, 07:53 PM   #105
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^Noone knows how well the bottom-end will handle a higher redline.

FYI, our J30A4/5s have a 1.88 rod/stroke ratio and a redline of 6800rpm and most of the B-series engines are <1.6 r/s and rev to 8000+rpm. It comes down to max piston speed and the strength of the rods and bolts.

EDIT: the rod/stroke ratio isn't the limiting factor for the redline

Last edited by gwiffer; January 18th, 2013 at 12:59 PM..
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Old January 18th, 2013, 08:30 AM   #106
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^Noone knows how well the bottom-end will handle a higher redline.

FYI, our J30A4/5s have a 1.88 rod/stroke ratio and a redline of 6800rpm and most of the B-series engines are <1.6 r/s and rev to 8000+rpm. It comes down to max piston speed and the strength of the rods and bolts.
Where did you get this info from? Apparently the F20C has a 1.82 rod/stroke ratio and revs to 9K (from what I read on 8G Civic)....this potentially means this motor could SCREAM!!! < (again, from 8G Civic).

EDIT: I found the rod length of 162mm on J32a.com and our bore is 86mm, which comes out to 1.88!!!
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Old January 18th, 2013, 09:14 AM   #107
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I don't think our oil pumps can keep up with 8-9k rpm.
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Old January 18th, 2013, 09:19 AM   #108
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^ That's an easy fix. S2K oil pump anyone? The K20s use it when they rev past 9K. Not sure if we could, but could potentially be an option. I think the bottom end would go before the oil pump, but (I really have no idea ).
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Old January 18th, 2013, 12:58 PM   #109
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Where did you get this info from? Apparently the F20C has a 1.82 rod/stroke ratio and revs to 9K (from what I read on 8G Civic)....this potentially means this motor could SCREAM!!! < (again, from 8G Civic).

EDIT: I found the rod length of 162mm on J32a.com and our bore is 86mm, which comes out to 1.88!!!
I misspoke, I don't think the rod/stroke ratio is what sets the redline. Some of the B16s have a r/s ratio of 1.74 and rev to 8000+rpm.
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Old January 18th, 2013, 01:22 PM   #110
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^ It's not what sets the redline, but from my understanding, it is a way to measure the potential revving capability of a motor. For example, F1 cars have over 2:1 R/S ratio.

Rod to Stroke Ratio - Tech - Honda Tuning Magazine
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Old January 18th, 2013, 02:24 PM   #111
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Any Updates?
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Old January 24th, 2013, 05:16 AM   #112
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^ i was wondering the same thing lol
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Old January 24th, 2013, 06:21 AM   #113
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Old January 24th, 2013, 06:53 AM   #114
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^ That's an easy fix. S2K oil pump anyone? The K20s use it when they rev past 9K. Not sure if we could, but could potentially be an option. I think the bottom end would go before the oil pump, but (I really have no idea ).
F20/22 use similar oil pump as the k series. The engines are nearly identical. They both are chain driven. You would not beable to mock that up on a J series engine. You can however custom a dry sump pump with the right amount of money
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Old January 24th, 2013, 09:56 AM   #115
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Old January 28th, 2013, 07:26 PM   #116
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Not sure if it hss been discussed. Right now there is what looks like an entire 07-08 TL base being parted out on ebay, including the wiring harness for $125 shipped.
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Old January 28th, 2013, 07:32 PM   #117
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Hondata has no plans for an Accord Flash. Complete Shame.

I emailed them and all i could do was plead our case.

Do you guys think there is a bigger market for the TL then Accord?
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Old January 28th, 2013, 07:41 PM   #118
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Hondata has no plans for an Accord Flash. Complete Shame.

I emailed them and all i could do was plead our case.

Do you guys think there is a bigger market for the TL then Accord?
No, we just got an ecu that is harder to work with. They dont want the possibility of someone bricking their ECU and blaming them. I cant blame them because I know someone eventually would do it. We just need to look at other alternatives, like the ecu swap.
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Old January 29th, 2013, 07:20 PM   #119
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Hondata has no plans for an Accord Flash. Complete Shame.

I emailed them and all i could do was plead our case.

Do you guys think there is a bigger market for the TL then Accord?
Answers in the first couple pages of thread.
Apparently more of a technical/political reason and less of a business market one:
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As someone else stated, the older ECUs are made by Motorola and they WILL NOT GIVE ANYTHING TO ANYONE EVER without alot of money, the newer ecu is made by Denso who Hondata has a long relationship with. So we can send as many requests to Hondata as we want, but thier hands are tied by Motorola.
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It is highly unlikely that Hondata will change their FlashPro hardware to support the slower communication protocol. The 04' ~ 06' TL and 7th gen Accord uses ISO9141 and runs at 10.4k bits/second (think dial-up speed). The 07' and later TLs as well as all other later Honda/Acura vehicles use CAN. This runs at 500k bits/second (think broadband speed).

Using the older protocol, it could take 15 minutes to re-flash the ECU. That's like an eternity.
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Old January 29th, 2013, 07:29 PM   #120
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Just jump on the reasonably price piggyback lol need more support since that seems to be our only hope for now, besides the AEM fic
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