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Old June 2nd, 2009, 06:55 PM   #1
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Bye Bye EGR.......

Well, not exactly, but damn close enough. As we all know the EGR system robs some power by injesting hot/dirty exhaust gases directly back into the intake. We can't remove the valve without throwing a code and we can't block it without throwing a code. If we block it the ECU throws a "Isufficent Flow" code as well as the ODB emissions monitor will show error since the ECU actually detects the lean out caused by the EGR opening and flowing exhaust back, and this is the key, the ECU does not care weather it is hot exhaust or cold/clean intake air. So I decedied to machine out a EGR Bypass Adaptor that allows us to connect eaither a breather filter or a hose connected back to the breather fitting on the intake. I just came back from a 50+ mile test drive with no codes thrown and for good mesure before I left on the drive I reset my ECU and emmissions monitors after the drive I checked and the EGR emissions monitor was happy with the bypass, so this will not effect passing emissions, and probably will pass visual if you hook a hose back into the intake.





Thanks to Shonda for jogging my brain and getting me to think of this.........

This will also work for 6th gens and K-series although the bypass connection is in a different place for Ks......
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 06:59 PM   #2
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saweet! paul you are having too much fun with that milling machine. lol
my car is going to need this. my CEL has been on for a while because of my EGR.
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 07:01 PM   #3
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So what all needs to be done to install this?
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 07:02 PM   #4
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Pull the two stock studs that hold the egr valve on and replace them with longer bolts.
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 07:05 PM   #5
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Any difference in power feel? I think this would be very beneficial to us with FI.

Keep on innovating Paul!
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 07:05 PM   #6
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Nate and I were just talking about this the other day.
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 07:48 PM   #7
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nice
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 08:10 PM   #8
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And what does the PCM do when it notices that the exhaust gas temp is way too high? It's probably going to pull timing which decreases power, right?
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 08:43 PM   #9
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It does not mesure exhaust temp, and how would not ingesting hot exhaust gases cause higher exhaust temps?????
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 08:56 PM   #10
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There's no EGT sensor on these cars? I didn't know that.

EGR lowers the combustion temperature. I believe this is because the exhaust gas can absorb greater specific heat. EGR also tends to make the engine more efficient because it allows advanced timing (lower temp = less preignition tendency) and less throttle loss (less power available at part throttle = higher throttle angle).

Isn't the EGR turned off at full engine load anyway? I've never done anything with a Honda engine at work, but all the GM/Chrysler/Ford engines have zero EGR flow at anything above like 90% throttle.

edit - I understand what you're trying to do, but it doesnt really work on modern cars with modern electronics and variable EGR. The EGR is off at full throttle so it only 'robs' power at part throttle, which in turn actually (and counterintuitively) makes the engine more efficient (better gas mileage). So unless you're a part throttle racer unconcerned with fuel economy, EGR is one of those things that does very little harm aside from a little more carbon deposits upstream of the cylinders. EGR does take a lot of power out of diesels and older gasoline engines, but in the modern ones it really makes no difference. I appreciate you trying to do new stuff and you've done a lot of bad ass things on the J series, but IMO this does more harm than good. However, if Honda uses the EGR at full throttle (unlike every other gasoline engine I've ever tested/instrumented), this is all wrong.

Last edited by 99VTECCoupe; June 2nd, 2009 at 09:25 PM..
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 08:59 PM   #11
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wow, finally. Ive been wanting to eliminate or some how modify the EGR for a while now. Nice work Paul!
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 09:10 PM   #12
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wow paul u r the best... what all is needed to get this done?
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 09:28 PM   #13
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so with this, the exhaust gases still get recylced but never make it into the intake manifold, only fresh air does? If i am correct here with my intrepretation of this, where do the recylced gases now go? If i'm way off please tell me.

Also, i too was under the impression that no exhaust gasses get recylced during full throttle? is that true?
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 09:30 PM   #14
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wow paul u r the best... What all is needed to get this done?
really wat do wee need to do for this ..? Gain hp or decrease ?
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 09:41 PM   #15
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EGR =/ DEI

http://www.autoblog.com/2007/11/16/a...ust-injection/
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 10:07 PM   #16
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Nice work Paul. What do I need to do to get you one for me? I have two extra EGR valves....

Also, we need to discuss the J37 or whatever the current popular/good build is... I've got the itch...

Car runs amazing, by the way... constant 37 mpg now. Love it.
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 10:10 PM   #17
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can u get me one for the k24 prettty please
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 10:11 PM   #18
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lol at DEI
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 10:20 PM   #19
hmmm what next?
 
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paul make another i want one just let me know via PM.
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 10:51 PM   #20
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ummm...I need that lets test that on my car
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 11:29 PM   #21
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Great job to NVA-AV6 and Chris
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Old June 2nd, 2009, 11:48 PM   #22
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Can I buy one.. lol
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Old June 3rd, 2009, 12:00 AM   #23
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wooot something for the 6th gen too!
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Old June 3rd, 2009, 12:11 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 99VTECCoupe View Post
Isn't the EGR turned off at full engine load anyway? I've never done anything with a Honda engine at work, but all the GM/Chrysler/Ford engines have zero EGR flow at anything above like 90% throttle.
yes, the EGR is off at both idle/WOT on these cars. the bypass paul has machined WILL allow for smoother (not higher) power delivery though midrange throttle %, but like you mentioned, it will be useless at WOT.
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Old June 3rd, 2009, 12:22 AM   #25
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wooot something for the 6th gen too!
x2
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Old June 3rd, 2009, 04:04 AM   #26
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I will make these avalible to whoever wants one, the cost will be $100 shipped which will include new correct legnth bolts and new EGR valve gaskets. The inlet will be 1/2" hose mipple so you can connect it with eaither a simple breather element or route a hose to the intake. I will pull together a step by step when I install one on Kai's car this Satruday. The hardest part of the install will be removing the existing studs, you have to take the two nuts and lock them against each other on the stud by tightening them against each other and then trun them out like bolts. Anyone interested please PM me.
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Old June 3rd, 2009, 04:05 AM   #27
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can u get me one for the k24 prettty please
Yes, just make sure I know it is for a K, the hose nipple has to be machined in a different location.
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Old June 3rd, 2009, 04:06 AM   #28
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Can I buy one.. lol
Yes, and I know I still have to pull out that cam and make the jig for machining a CL-S one for you...
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Old June 3rd, 2009, 04:07 AM   #29
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ummm...I need that lets test that on my car
LOL, I knew you were going to say that.
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Old June 3rd, 2009, 04:09 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by pbook4g5 View Post
Nice work Paul. What do I need to do to get you one for me? I have two extra EGR valves....

Also, we need to discuss the J37 or whatever the current popular/good build is... I've got the itch...

Car runs amazing, by the way... constant 37 mpg now. Love it.
Great, I figured you would eng up just a little shy of J36/J35 MPGs, give me a call and we can discuss Stage 2...
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