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Old March 28th, 2009, 07:03 AM   #1
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Arrow 24mm Rear Sway Bar and End Links Compared to OEM

I realize that there is already a DIY on the rear sway bar but just to give people an idea of how our stock parts compare to what is available i thought i would just put together these pictures.

Beginning the project:
Moog end links for 98-02 accord
Progress 24mm adjustable rear sway bar for 04 Acura TL




From this point on realize that I live in northern Indiana where they think salt should coat the streets all winter long.

The sway bar is the bar going close to horizontal in this picture:



Dropped the sway bar hangers:



Cut off the oem end links:



OEM vs. Progress bar... are we sure ours is a 17mm it looks like a 12mm compared to the progress bar:





This is the one i couldn't find anywhere and it is also the reason for the post:

Moog vs. OEM end links I was really shocked at the difference because everyone I talked to said there were no upgrades for the accord.





*I know its the worst signature ever but thats what happens when you only have mspaint also mods let me know if its "legal"* thanks

Last edited by nixed007; March 28th, 2009 at 08:01 AM..
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Old March 28th, 2009, 08:37 AM   #2
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Nice. I am looking for the moog endlinks too.


Which setting did you put it on? Did you notice a difference?
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Old March 28th, 2009, 08:47 AM   #3
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I'm looking to get a progress as well. Nice review!

So when you remove oem sway, the OEM endlinks are no longer useful right and you'd probably want to upgrade while you're down there? Does the progress come with any hardware?
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Old March 28th, 2009, 04:07 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eazyduuzit View Post
Nice. I am looking for the moog endlinks too.


Which setting did you put it on? Did you notice a difference?


If you have an o'reilly auto parts store you can get them there. or on ebay every once in a while. As for the setting i put it on the hole furthest back, I believe this is the stiffer one.


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I'm looking to get a progress as well. Nice review!

So when you remove oem sway, the OEM endlinks are no longer useful right and you'd probably want to upgrade while you're down there? Does the progress come with any hardware?
Unless you have no rust it is easier just to cut the end links off and replace them.
As for the hardware it includes urethane bushings with metal flanges and replacement hex nuts so everything you would need to do a full replacement except the end links.

Some people choose to upgrade the end links before the bar so they can spread the cost out. I am told you will notice a difference just in a stronger end link although idk. I would not recommend putting oem end links back on... who wants to deal with rusted bolts twice?!?
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Old March 28th, 2009, 04:10 PM   #5
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I dunno...I didnt have trouble with my OE endlinks..I dont know why everyone fusses about them. I bought stock replacements and ended up not needing them
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Old March 28th, 2009, 04:14 PM   #6
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But they look so much beefier than the oem ones!
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Old March 28th, 2009, 07:42 PM   #7
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How much is the progress part? I know I can get a rear sway from a 04-06 TL 6MT which is pretty much the same specs as the progress with new bushings brackets and bolts for $65 shipped.
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Old March 28th, 2009, 07:46 PM   #8
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Its a little over 100 dollars if I remember correctly.
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Old March 28th, 2009, 07:57 PM   #9
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hmm i thought the cheapest progress sway was around 140?
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Old March 28th, 2009, 09:57 PM   #10
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140 is a little over 100...
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Old March 28th, 2009, 11:34 PM   #11
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I never had any issues with my stock endlinks but those ones look pretty nice. Wonder how much better they really are. My endlinks are still in good shape!



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Old April 10th, 2009, 05:58 AM   #12
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Sway Bar Linkage Bolts Removal
A note on the difficulty in removing the linkage bolts on the Accord sway bars. This difficulty is mainly due to Honda's use of lock nuts with deformed thread for the linkage bolts, for safety reasons. The deformed thread greatly increase the friction with the bolt threads, preventing them from loosening. To ease removal, wire brush the threads clean, apply a penetrating oil to lubricate the covered threads as best as possible, and apply anti-seize compound to the exposed bolt threads for reduced friction as the nut is unthreaded.

I posted the above earlier on this forum
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Old April 10th, 2009, 06:21 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eazyduuzit View Post
I am looking for the moog endlinks too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nixed007 View Post
If you have an o'reilly auto parts store you can get them there. or on ebay every once in a while.
I got mine at advanced auto for $25 each. For some reason the O'reilly's auto near me didn't have them.
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Old April 27th, 2009, 01:06 AM   #14
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where do you "cut" the end links?
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Old April 27th, 2009, 06:17 AM   #15
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when you are looking at the photo above: see how there is a hex nut, the sway bar, and then the end link flange. Where the end link attaches to the car it looks about the same, hex nut, where the end link attaches to the car and the end link flange. You are going to what to cut the part between the end link flange and the place where the end link attaches to the car.

Please note: that if you don't have much rust you can just un-bolt it. Also soaking it in some CLR or PB-Blaster may make it easy enough to get off that you won't have to cut it. I live in Indiana where they think salt solves everything so my car has a lot of rusted bolts.
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Old April 27th, 2009, 08:44 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by NVA-AV6 View Post
How much is the progress part? I know I can get a rear sway from a 04-06 TL 6MT which is pretty much the same specs as the progress with new bushings brackets and bolts for $65 shipped.
04-06 TL MT sway bar is 20mm.

I'm satisfied with mine; dunno if I should upgrade.
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Old April 27th, 2009, 10:07 AM   #17
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sell yours and then upgrade! If you are satisfied with yours why change but i will tell you you will notice a difference. Think about it you went from a 17mm to a 20mm (3mm) going from a 20mm to a 24mm is going to have just as much difference if not more. And i haven't noticed any over-steer with mine although i am still on factory sized tires so i get a lot of sway just in my sidewalls
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Old April 27th, 2009, 11:01 AM   #18
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I didn't know you could adjust endlinks to be softer or stiffer...can someone elaborate on how that works?
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Old April 27th, 2009, 11:16 AM   #19
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^^ on the TL progress bar there are two holes on each side of the bar. One toward the front of the car the other toward the rear. This allows you to adjust stiffness. The back hole makes the setup stiffer because it reduces the length of the bar and also "stretches" the end link further back giving it more strength. The end link itself is not adjustable.


picture thanks to progress auto group
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Old April 28th, 2009, 09:42 AM   #20
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Ugh this is tempting. Looking under my rear the other day and now my TL rsb is looking tiny.

I think I'll upgrade again, but my oem endlinks are still good too.
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Old April 29th, 2009, 04:04 PM   #21
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Adjustable swaybars work on geometry principles. The shorter the end arms on the swaybar the stiffer the operation. As you shorter the end arms, the swaybar twists more for the same wheel travel, applying more torque.

For example, the endlink is in the end hole on the end arm of the swaybar. For a 2" wheel rise the swaybar will twist a certain amount (swaybar end arm rotates). Now move the endlink to the medial hole, which shortens the effective length of the end arm. When the wheel rises 2" now, the lever arm will twist more, applying more torque to the swaybar. The bolt hole on the end arm has to move approximately 2" in both situations, but one has a longer end arm to allow the movement so it rotates less.
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Old May 6th, 2009, 10:39 AM   #22
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Does anyone know if the Progress sway bar is better off than the Comptech one, I know there's a 2mm difference between the two, just wanted some comparisons, b/c I really haven't done much to my car lately.
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Old May 19th, 2009, 04:38 PM   #23
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Does anyone know if the Progress sway bar is better off than the Comptech one, I know there's a 2mm difference between the two, just wanted some comparisons, b/c I really haven't done much to my car lately.

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sell yours and then upgrade! If you are satisfied with yours why change but i will tell you you will notice a difference. Think about it you went from a 17mm to a 20mm (3mm) going from a 20mm to a 24mm is going to have just as much difference if not more. And i haven't noticed any over-steer with mine although i am still on factory sized tires so i get a lot of sway just in my sidewalls
So you are picking up and extra 2mm as for the cost?!? if you can sell you comptech bar the difference is worth it but up front cost to switch wouldn't be imo
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Old June 5th, 2009, 11:58 AM   #24
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very interesting. I have the comptech bar but I wonder how different this set up would be. Any thoughts
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Old June 5th, 2009, 12:43 PM   #25
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Your Comptech bar is thinner so the rear won't rotate as easily as the Progress...

Can't really say much about the endlinks though, I don't have the aftermarket ones.



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Old June 24th, 2009, 11:28 AM   #26
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I'm going to try out those endlinks! Hey, thank you for the info folks.
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Old June 29th, 2009, 03:42 PM   #27
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The stiffness of the sway bar is proportional to the diameter of the bar to the 4th power, or diameter X diameter X diameter X diameter. So a small change in sway bar diameter has a large change in sway bar stiffness.

Sway Bar Diameter (Solid) Versus Relative Sway Bar Torsional Stiffness
16mm ... 1.00 ... Accord 4dr 98-02
17mm ... 1.27 ... Accord 2dr 98-02, Acura TL Auto 04-06
19mm ... 1.99 ... Acura CL-S, Acura TL-S Manual 02-03, Neuspeed
20mm ... 2.44 ... Acura TL-S Manual 04-06
22mm ... 3.57 ... Comptech
23mm ... 4.27 ... Eibach
24mm ... 5.06 ... Progress

Total roll stiffness is a sum of the forces resulting from 1) the sway bar and 2)the suspension springs.
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Old June 29th, 2009, 04:09 PM   #28
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isnt a thicker RSB jsut going to give you a ****ton more oversteer?
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Old June 29th, 2009, 06:23 PM   #29
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I wouldn't say a ****ton. I would say that a sway bar helps the rear rotate easier through the power of persuasion.



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Old June 30th, 2009, 07:08 AM   #30
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A front engine/front wheel drive car is going to inherently understeer (front end slides before rear). You stiffen the rear suspension through a combination of stiffer sway bars and suspension springs to help balance the handling. Too stiff a rear compared to the front, and you probably could get oversteer (rear end slides before the front), especially on wet roads. You have to go pretty stiff though. You are trying to achieve a balance, so stiffer is not alway better. Due to different suspension tuning parts, springs, wheels, tires, ride height, the optimum sway bar stiffness will be slightly different from car to car of the same model. Race cars use adjustable sway bars, which are frequently adjusted.

Last edited by Winter; June 30th, 2009 at 07:25 AM..
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