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Old November 22nd, 2004, 05:59 PM   #1
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supercharge ? or turbocharge ?

hey wasup guyz i need help

im deciding on spending some ash on either a super charger or a turbocharger.....im getting all these feedbackz from my friends that driving me nuts. i jus want to know which is better for my car....which does the least damage.. money ? which is better in performance......please reply back

im drivin a ex v6 automatic accord coupe

thank you
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Old November 22nd, 2004, 06:00 PM   #2
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i belive comptech is coming out with the supercharger for your car soon
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Old November 22nd, 2004, 07:47 PM   #3
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This is an argued subject here as well, but Ill give it a shot and then read what others have to say.

A turbo is going to give crazy gains, a supercharger is going to be more driveable. A turbo may require changes of the internals of the engine. A supercharger should be able to run on stock internals.

A supercharger is going to help more with low end gains because it is boosting instantly. Where as a turbo is going to spool for top end gains.

Here is the biggest difference for me- there will be supercharger kits coming out for our cars. This means the hardware and the software nessisary to run properly will be included. A custom turbo system is going to require tons and tons of R/D.

I guess if you are building a car that will see track time on a regular basis and pure speed is the goal, I would go turbo. If you want a daily driver that runs strong and will be reliable, I would say supercharger.

Personally I plan to go comptech supercharger. Plenty of power, and usable across the board. Backed by comptech quality? Cant beat it in my book.
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Old November 22nd, 2004, 07:52 PM   #4
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why do you think you'd need to change the internals for a turbocharger but not a supercharger?

edit: otherwise no real disagreement with anything else you said.
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Old November 22nd, 2004, 08:03 PM   #5
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why do you think you'd need to change the internals for a turbocharger but not a supercharger?

edit: otherwise no real disagreement with anything else you said.
I'd like to know that also...

You can't say you need to change the internals just because you have a turbo. Both the supercharger and the turbocharger force air into the engine. The amount of air it "Forces" in is measured the same way. If comptech releases the supercharger with a 6psi pulley and doesn't need upgraded internals then a turbo boosted to 6psi won't need upgraded internals. Its all depends on how much you boost. I've heard the engine should reliably handle around 10 lbs of boost but who know until they blow an engine on the 7th gen.
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Old November 22nd, 2004, 08:05 PM   #6
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If Vortech or someone who deicdes to produce a supercharger i think thats your best bet with say an aftercooler
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Old November 22nd, 2004, 08:11 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by blu6speed
Personally I plan to go comptech supercharger. Plenty of power, and usable across the board. Backed by comptech quality? Cant beat it in my book.


I too would much rather buy a R&D'd and proven product by a very professional/experienced manufacturer like Comptech than to go custom (too many unknown variables)
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Old November 22nd, 2004, 08:16 PM   #8
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btw, for the record, you have an auto. i'd be wary of putting too much stress on those. although, if you're willing to fork over cash if the supercharger slushies your transmission, then be my guest. i hope you prove me wrong (i've got an auto too)
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Old November 22nd, 2004, 09:06 PM   #9
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Yeah your correct about the amount of boost being the true determining factor. Only reason I said a supercharger would be more reasonable on internals is because typically superchargers are associated with lower boost, where as a turbo is typically higher boost. Sorry should have made that clearer. I guess if the amount of boost was the same coming from both units- say 6-8 lbs stock internals would be fine with either one.

I cant wait to see how a high boost pulley will help things. I too have heard 10 lbs of boost is the max our engines can handle on stock internals, but its all speculation until **** starts blowing up...hell we dont even have a kit yet!!
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Old November 22nd, 2004, 09:39 PM   #10
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If the Nissan VQ30 has been proven on stock internals to handle over 20 psi and 600 wtq (link - hlh0501 is legit) then a Honda J30 should be able to handle way more than just a wimpy 10 psi.

Yeah, a lot of people seem to say 10 psi is the limit of the interals, but they're purely speculating and aren't even checking out other competing engines to see what they're able to do. It would be truly sad if 10 psi was all the J30 could do in light of what the VQ guys are doing over at maxima.org
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Old November 22nd, 2004, 09:52 PM   #11
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Quote:
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If the Nissan VQ30 has been proven on stock internals to handle over 20 psi and 600 wtq (link - hlh0501 is legit) then a Honda J30 should be able to handle way more than just a wimpy 10 psi.

Yeah, a lot of people seem to say 10 psi is the limit of the interals, but they're purely speculating and aren't even checking out other competing engines to see what they're able to do. It would be truly sad if 10 psi was all the J30 could do in light of what the VQ guys are doing over at maxima.org
are the maxima guys running that amount of boost for a long time? like 40k miles. I know that having forced induction will lower the life of the engine but I dont something that decreases the engine life by like half
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Old November 22nd, 2004, 09:56 PM   #12
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there are lots of guys that have run 10 psi daily driven for a long time with no issues. and who says you're going to cut engine life by half? and if so, half of what? If the engine lasts 300-400k, then it'll only last 150-200k? You'll have gone through pretty much every other drivetrain component two or three times already by then, and your car will still be falling apart. The engine is by far the strongest part of the car.
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Old December 3rd, 2004, 12:56 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteVTEC
why do you think you'd need to change the internals for a turbocharger but not a supercharger?
That is quite an obvious answer. Turbo's run on much higher boost than a supercharger.

example: Comptech's Accord supercharger is like 5.5 to maybe 6 psi, while turbo's (depending on what you buy) can get as high as the high teens and even the 20's and sometimes 30's! Do you REALLY think that an accord engine with stock internals can handle that amount of boost? The answer is no, unless of course you beef up the engine to help resist that kind of engine strain.

If I had a choice, I would choose a supercharger any day of the week and TWICE on Sundays!
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Old December 3rd, 2004, 01:25 AM   #14
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more boost = more power. the comptech supercharger will give like 80 horsepower, maybe. turbos can give like 200, 400, even 600 horsepower.
the comptech supercharger is just WEAK in comparison to real turbo systems.
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Old December 3rd, 2004, 05:35 AM   #15
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That is quite an obvious answer. Turbo's run on much higher boost than a supercharger.

example: Comptech's Accord supercharger is like 5.5 to maybe 6 psi, while turbo's (depending on what you buy) can get as high as the high teens and even the 20's and sometimes 30's! Do you REALLY think that an accord engine with stock internals can handle that amount of boost? The answer is no, unless of course you beef up the engine to help resist that kind of engine strain.

If I had a choice, I would choose a supercharger any day of the week and TWICE on Sundays!
OK, turbos CAN run higher boost. People running high teens to the 30's in boost have cars that either internal work done or are turboed cars from the factory, ie the supra TT, evo, sti, etc... The turbo kits for the 4cylinder hondas by rev hard or drag come with i believe a 6psi spring in the wastegate. Most people with aftermarket turbo kits run around I'd say 10 psi or lower daily driver on cars that aren't turbocharged from the factory and haven't done any internal work.
SO yea, my statement still stands, whether or not you need internal work depends on how much boost you run.
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Old December 3rd, 2004, 05:59 AM   #16
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Guys please don't forget that the actual pressure of the air being passed through the compressor is not the only variable when it comes to forced induction. Theres also the actual amount of air (CFM) that makes a difference, theres variables that depend on how you have the car tuned, what kind of fuel you tune the vehicle on.

SO MUCH MORE STUFF to think about so lets not assume things. Comptech plans to release a supercharger sometime in the future, and the gains will probably be in line with their previous kits. Turbo chargers make the SAME power on the SAME boost and SAME airflow. It's just that turbochargers run more boost and flow more air on avg. Right now theres nothing, so your making whatever you put it, and just hope the tranny can handle it
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Old December 3rd, 2004, 06:52 AM   #17
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Guys please don't forget that the actual pressure of the air being passed through the compressor is not the only variable when it comes to forced induction. Theres also the actual amount of air (CFM) that makes a difference, theres variables that depend on how you have the car tuned, what kind of fuel you tune the vehicle on.

SO MUCH MORE STUFF to think about so lets not assume things. Comptech plans to release a supercharger sometime in the future, and the gains will probably be in line with their previous kits. Turbo chargers make the SAME power on the SAME boost and SAME airflow. It's just that turbochargers run more boost and flow more air on avg. Right now theres nothing, so your making whatever you put it, and just hope the tranny can handle it
I'm thinking out loud but how is the air flow affected without change the boost pressure and the pipe diameter? I thought air flow was directly proportionate to the boost pressure given the same diameter piping. how is the air flow measured in a FI system?? What can change the amount of air flow?? I'm not trying to be smart I just want to learn

Regarding the comptech supercharger, I believe the supercharger for the 6th accord was originally designed with the 6 psi but the researchers found out the trannies couldn't handle that much boost so they replaced the psi boost pulley with a lower one, maybe 3 of 4 psi and made the 6lb pulley an option if you called in and requested it. I think with the 7th gen 6 speed kits they will have at least a 6 lb boost pulley with maybe an optional higher boost pulley. So the numbers should be better.
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Old December 3rd, 2004, 07:31 AM   #18
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Old December 9th, 2004, 03:17 PM   #19
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Right now I am in the process of bulding a custom turbo kit. Also the kit i am making will cost about $1000 cheaper than the comptech supercharger and that is not with cheap parts. I have heard from a previous post of mine that our motors can hold about 400 to 450whp, but they said that the tranny cant hold quite that much. An inverter can fix the transmission problem causing it to not shift as hard. I am still doing some research and about to talk to some mechanics for Honda and find out what they have to say. When it comes to picking a supercharger or turbo kit i think its a personal preference. They are quite similar. I think that it is like chosing between the WRX STI and a EVO VIII. Well i should have the turbo on by about february so when i get it on i will post my thoughts.
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Old December 11th, 2004, 01:25 AM   #20
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^^ well.. instead of risking the auto tranny.. consider a 6mt swap first.
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Old December 11th, 2004, 09:35 AM   #21
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^ Anyone know where I can search for a used/rebuilt 6-spd tranny?
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Old December 11th, 2004, 01:59 PM   #22
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a lot of junk yard out there now has 6mt tranny from 3k to 10k miles... price.. anywhere from 1.5k to 2.5k.. gotta shop around..

also.. remember, it is not just the tranny u need to get.. ecu, intake manifold, gauge, main harness and wires, gas and clutch pedals to name a few.....
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Old December 13th, 2004, 07:12 AM   #23
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Old December 13th, 2004, 11:53 AM   #24
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I forgot- but what happened to the idea of putting in one of the old TL or CL trannys that had an LSD- did anyone ever do it or was it shot down?

If you're looking for a new tranny I'd go with one with an LSD instead of the Accord 6MT
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Old December 13th, 2004, 11:56 AM   #25
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I forgot- but what happened to the idea of putting in one of the old TL or CL trannys that had an LSD- did anyone ever do it or was it shot down?

If you're looking for a new tranny I'd go with one with an LSD instead of the Accord 6MT
the trannys are exactly the same as the cl-s6 trannys except for the lsd. From the pictures and diagrams i've seen the cl-s6 lsd looks like it will be a direct bolt on to the 6mt on the accord, but no one here has tried it yet. I may try it in the near future.
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Old December 13th, 2004, 12:04 PM   #26
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the trannys are exactly the same as the cl-s6 trannys except for the lsd. From the pictures and diagrams i've seen the cl-s6 lsd looks like it will be a direct bolt on to the 6mt on the accord, but no one here has tried it yet. I may try it in the near future.
I'd love to grab one as well- I don't think I'd be able to afford it though- perhaps if my tranny goes... but let's hope not!
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Old December 13th, 2004, 12:17 PM   #27
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not true. it has been done. read the technical thread on it. one of brex's friends did it. $4000.
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Old December 13th, 2004, 12:37 PM   #28
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When I think about supercharging or turbocharging... I would most definitely leave it to manufacturers to come out with something (NO CUSTOM TURBO KITS!) - like others said, not enough R&D, etc.

Supercharger is going to be easier to install (unless this STS turbo system comes out)I would say because your not really touching the exhaust components, plus I dont know how we could do a turbo on the 7th Gens because of the moron engineers at Honda putting this cast manifold bullsh*t on our heads. Which btw is the dumbest thing I have ever seen.

Anyway, Id definitely rather have a turbo for power. I dont think we need more low-end, and if everyone is so bent on getting more power a turbo is a better option in my mind. Spool-up will not be a big deal because 1st of all, turbos are much better now (ball bearing ones), compared to the older thrust bearings, and also, we have descent high compression and 3L motors, that 6-8psi is going to hit quick! Id rather have 6-8psi when I nail the gas than waiting for a supercharger to hit max boost, while draining my car of its own power as well. Not badmouthing supercharging, but I think turbo’s are slightly better – just not economical for us 7th gen owners.

However, it looks like turbo (other than this STS business) is pretty much out of the picture. If STS somehow provides a good turbo system for around $4000 and makes the same power or more as a Comptech Supercharger (which will cost $1500-2000 more and be harder to install than STS system) than I think that would be great.

Im still waiting for some god damnpullies! ****, the SUBARU Forester has pullies, how could Honda Accords not?!?! How many people mod their Subaru Foresters??! What is wrong with Unorthodox. We could all sure use 10whp for $300! I know I could
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Old December 13th, 2004, 12:53 PM   #29
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If STS somehow provides a good turbo system for around $4000 and makes the same power or more as a Comptech Supercharger (which will cost $1500-2000 more and be harder to install than STS system)

Not true at all. Comptech's supercharger will go for about $4,000 to about $4,500 tops, just like the 6th generation supercharger did. It will not cost $2,000 more than the STS turbo. If anything, the 2 will be very close to the same price. And how do you figure that the supercharger will be harder to install than the turbo? Just wondering. Thanks.
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Old December 13th, 2004, 01:05 PM   #30
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It sounds like the STS Turbo will be easier to install and have better performance gains as well.

If I had the $4k and had to choose I'd go with the STS
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