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Old October 20th, 2003, 05:32 PM   #1
 
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C32 AMG - Dyno



Gives me a good base to work from. Same year as mine. There is a Dyno Import day coming up in St.Louis County I am planing to take the C32 to, will hopefully get same if not better numbers.
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Old October 20th, 2003, 05:53 PM   #2
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Old October 20th, 2003, 05:56 PM   #3
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Nearly 310 to the wheels, eh?

That puts it at nearly 400 chp stock, not 349. Another under-rated Benz.
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Old October 22nd, 2003, 01:04 AM   #4
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I guess the Germans like being semi-sleepers with the underatings.
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Old October 22nd, 2003, 01:08 AM   #5
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310 WHP and 325 wtq? Weak!! LOL, just kidding

That is niiiiiiiiice
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Old October 22nd, 2003, 04:38 AM   #6
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is this the fastest benz???? I think so... it's the lightest w/ the most hourse power... runs about 4.8sec auto tranny 0-60.... don't think any other benz does that #, that's like a M3 manual #!!!
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Old October 22nd, 2003, 12:26 PM   #7
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You might want to check out the CL65. It runs 11s-12s.
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Old October 22nd, 2003, 06:14 PM   #8
 
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Originally posted by SteVTEC
Nearly 310 to the wheels, eh?

That puts it at nearly 400 chp stock, not 349. Another under-rated Benz.
What math are you using? If his car has 400fwhp, that means his car loses almost 30% through the drivetrain, which I doubt MB has such an inneficent drivetrain. His car puts out closer to 365fwhp...
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Old October 22nd, 2003, 06:16 PM   #9
 
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Not the fastest, but comfortably fast for 4 doors. I do not plan on doing any upgrades though for a while. There are several items that will increase speed, which includes nitrous and /or differnt pully
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Old October 22nd, 2003, 06:18 PM   #10
 
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Originally posted by alumar
Not the fastest, but comfortably fast for 4 doors. I do not plan on doing any upgrades though for a while. There are several items that will increase speed, which includes nitrous and /or differnt pully
I bet a pulley/exhaust will make that thing scream, nice #'s
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Old October 22nd, 2003, 06:43 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by PSDPimp on October 22nd, 2003 at 08:14 PM

What math are you using? If his car has 400fwhp, that means his car loses almost 30% through the drivetrain, which I doubt MB has such an inneficent drivetrain. His car puts out closer to 365fwhp...
310 rwhp / 0.78 (22% drivetrain loss) = 397 crank horse power
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Old October 22nd, 2003, 06:54 PM   #12
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by SteVTEC
310 rwhp / 0.78 (22% drivetrain loss) = 397 crank horse power
Where did you get the .78?

310rwhp x 22% drivetrain loss=68.2hp

310+68.2=378fwhp

I doubt the C32 loses 22%, thats FWD territory...
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Old October 22nd, 2003, 06:58 PM   #13
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That's not how you calculate it.

397 chp x 0.78 = 310 rwhp
310 rwhp / 0.78 = 397 chp
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Old October 22nd, 2003, 07:34 PM   #14
 
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lol, what was I thinking?

100-22=78 derr
310x.78=397

But like I was saying, his car doesnt lose 22%, my FWD Regal loses 21%, I can gaurantee a RWD Benz doesnt more than a FWD Buick.
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Old October 22nd, 2003, 07:49 PM   #15
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hehe...

It's tough to establish solid "loss" numbers like this. The only way to do that is to pull the engine and dyno it on a crank dyno as per SAE specs for getting net HP and then compare it to what it gets on a chassis inertia dyno. For all you know the rated numbers for your regal might have been a tad low. Or maybe you just have a stronger than average engine. Or the dyno might have read a tad high. The possibilities are endless.

An Infiniti G35 sedan automatic is rated at 260hp, yet it dynos at 220 rwhp on a Dynojet. That would be only a 15% "loss" for an automatic. But as it turns out, the engine is under-rated and is really making the same 280hp that the G35 coupe is. Back to a 22% loss right around where it ought to be again. The G35c auto dynos at 220 rwhp also.

As for FWD vs RWD, there is one argument that says that RWD cars will dyno a little lower because of the longer driveshaft and the 90 degree bend at the diff that a FWD transverse setup doesn't have. But then there is another argument that says that FWD might dyno a little lower than RWD because a FWD differential and transmission is more complex.

Who knows

I honestly haven't seen any real difference between FWD and RWD. Even if there was a difference, it's probably small enough that it would never really be measurable.
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Old October 22nd, 2003, 08:04 PM   #16
 
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Interesting.

The only difference I'm going off of is between my F-250, and the Regal.

My regal put out 135/178 to the wheels(170/225) which comes out to a 21% loss.

And my F-250 spit out 193/410 to the wheels(235/500) which figures out to 18% and from other people I know have put out similiar #'s

But like you said, both could in actuality have more/less hp, thats just what we are "estimating" and the only way to find out is to pull the engines and dyno them...
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 01:53 AM   #17
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DAmn sneaky manufacturers and their "ratings". Mazda overrates while the Germans underrate.
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 04:31 AM   #18
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by Doom878 on October 23rd, 2003 at 03:53 AM

DAmn sneaky manufacturers and their "ratings". Mazda overrates while the Germans underrate.
Actually many companies underrate some of there engines. Mazda is the only one I know of that actually overrates there's . They overrated the Miata (back when it came out), the Mazda 6s, and the RX8. I don't know maybe they are using messed up dyno's .



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Old October 23rd, 2003, 05:25 AM   #19
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You guys are not up to speed on Mazdas.

The "ABS" light comes on during dyno runs and apparently the ECU cuts timing and makes the mixture extremely rich because it senses a lot of wheelspin and goes into a very mild safe mode. This apparently is why the 6s and RX-8's have been dynoing low. With all 4 wheels spinning that would not happen, so it might not be possible to accurately dyno the cars without defeating all of the safeguards somehow. I think somebody at the RX-8 forums managed to do that by pulling a bunch of fuses or something and it dynoed much better, but I haven't actually seen the dyno to confirm.
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 06:53 AM   #20
 
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Noticed some folks saying fwhp .. the C32 is Rear Wheel Drive, as all mercedes (besides the 4wheel drive versions :P 4matic)

Several Mercedes boards are saying 16-18% loss from Crank to Wheels on the C32 also
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 07:01 AM   #21
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16-18% "loss" on an automatic is nearly impossible. It's just that the engine is under-rated.

The Benzo S600 is rated at 493hp. But "Treynor" dynoed his stock one at like 470 rwhp. That would be a whole 5% "loss" which is impossible on an inertia dyno. The engine was simply massively under-rated and is putting out in excess of even 600 hp

Yes, 16-18% "loss" based on the rated crank figures for a C32. But that assumes that the crank figure is rated accurately to begin with which is often not the case on Mercedes and many other German vehicles. The Germans are well-known to sandbag a bit on many (not all) of their power ratings.

If you have an automatic transmission and you're getting lower than maybe a 20% "loss" on a rolling load inertia dyno (Dynojet), then it's highly likely that the engine's factory ratings are very conservative. Getting an automatic to actually have that low of a loss is impossible because it involves defying the laws of physics. But it's very easy to fib on crank horsepower numbers because thats simply a marketing move and marketers lie all the time.
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 07:16 AM   #22
 
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Damn Steve, peep the knowledge.
so hey check it, what about these auto trannys that have these auto lock up torque converters, do they lose as much?
but seriously do you really think the C32 makes 400chp.
if so then how much is the E39 M5 really making at the crank since they say it makes 400? yeah i know is a stick but thats still something to think about. maybe Benz just knows how to build effecient auto trannys, hell they've been doing it forever, and theyr about to release the 1st auto tranny with 7 cogs, so couldnt it be that thier skills defy conventional tranny power loss rules.

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Old October 23rd, 2003, 08:21 AM   #23
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Speaking of "Treynor", here's his M5 page: http://www.treynor.com/M5_Mods.htm

About 330 rwhp stock. I've heard of them dynoing in the 340-350 rwhp range completely stock though so maybe this was a lower one. Anyways, 17% is a good universal "loss" number for manual trannys so that would come out to anywhere from 397 - 421 hp. The factory rating for the US model was actually 394hp, so that would put the engine about on target, or perhaps a tad conservative but nothing to write home about compared to some other German cars.

By definition, a rolling load inertia based chassis dyno always has you accelerating. It takes energy to accelerate the engine, the transmission, the driveshaft, and the wheels. The "real" loss of the entire drivetrain even on an automatic is only around 5% or so. All the rest of what you see is inertial losses due to acceleration. If you took a 6th Gen AV6 and hooked it up to an active load dyno like a Dynapack that was capable of applying a load to the engine such that the RPM's would remain steady at WOT, that means there is no acceleration in the drivetrain and all of the inertial losses disappear. So now it would be putting about 190 fwhp to the ground instead of 155 fwhp. A passive roller dyno is actually more relevant though, because you can never really recreate that actively loaded scenario in the real world. But an active load dyno that holds the revs steady is extremely useful for advanced tuning and it's also more sensitive to small changes than a dynojet which is another plus for advanced tuning.
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 08:56 AM   #24
 
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ah, i see i seee.
drop that knowledge cuz.
but that passive dyno is kinda pointless though, since the hp is used in real life for acceleration, it sure would make nice ego boosters.
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 06:21 PM   #25
 
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Hrm, looking at that m5's dyno, looks like the C32 is putting down the same amount ...
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 06:33 PM   #26
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Slightly less power at the wheels than an M5, but also a good bit lighter. Net result: both will run low to mid-13's and are probably equally quick.

Wow! Maybe I'll get me a used C32 in a few years.
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 07:00 PM   #27
 
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There's a guy on the www.c32life.com site selling one in chicago 2002 C32 AMG, Orion Blue, Black Leather /w GPS System 19,200miles - $38,000.00 firm

That is a steal people....
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 09:06 PM   #28
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by alumar
Noticed some folks saying fwhp .. the C32 is Rear Wheel Drive, as all mercedes (besides the 4wheel drive versions :P 4matic)

Several Mercedes boards are saying 16-18% loss from Crank to Wheels on the C32 also
By FWHP, I mean Fly Wheel Horse Power
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 09:10 PM   #29
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Nice numbers

The C32 AMG is fast but it ain't nuthin' comparing to the $180K CL65 AMG.
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Old October 23rd, 2003, 09:26 PM   #30
 
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Nice numbers

The C32 AMG is fast but it ain't nuthin' comparing to the $180K CL65 AMG.
The CL65 AMG is pretty fast, but its nothing compare to the DMC-12!!!


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