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Thread: NOS, Turbo, Supercharge Reply to Thread
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Topic Review (Newest First)
August 11th, 2004 02:41 PM
SpeedRacer A turbo or supercharger running low boost and properly tuned will not severely affect engine life, but by nature it's still putting more strain on the motor and car. If you want FI and stock reliability, be prepared to spend tons of money building the motor.

It's like the old saying:

1. Cheap
2. Reliable
3. Fast

You can only pick two.
August 11th, 2004 02:40 PM
jiggerman78 your tranny will get raped...
August 11th, 2004 02:33 PM
DangerMouse
Quote:
Originally Posted by abram2001
If you want your tranny to turn into a slurpee machine, then go for it


Awesome writeup, me likey. So what would you say would be the most durable setup? Like if I want to maintain the "Honda engines will run for 10 years" concept, what would be the best way to go (other than staying stock). Or does all FI severely limit engine life?
August 11th, 2004 09:38 AM
deuzezwild would it really be that bad?
August 11th, 2004 01:01 AM
abram2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by brex
who says only 6mt can get FI!!... i want turbo too!!
no comment

If you want your tranny to turn into a slurpee machine, then go for it
August 11th, 2004 12:50 AM
brex
Quote:
Originally Posted by abram2001
lol, thanks Andy


I will add more things later on... there is MANY things I left out that could help some potential 7th gen 6speeds that go FI sooner or later.
who says only 6mt can get FI!!... i want turbo too!!
August 10th, 2004 11:53 PM
abram2001 lol, thanks Andy


I will add more things later on... there is MANY things I left out that could help some potential 7th gen 6speeds that go FI sooner or later.
August 10th, 2004 11:44 PM
brex I only got one thing to add...











Abby.. you're awsome!! Good writeup...
August 10th, 2004 10:22 PM
abram2001 added some more things if you missed it ^
August 10th, 2004 09:12 PM
abram2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteVTEC
.......Likewise, there are similar issues with superchargers also. There are different types: roots, centrifugal, and one other type. Some are great for top-end, others give you lots of power right off the line. I forget which is which, though. The Stillen S/C for the Maxima doesn't give much boost below 4000 rpm. On the otherhand, the setup on the Grand Prix GTP gives TONS of boost in the low-end and mid-range but drops off up top.

Another one of the superchargers Steve didnt mention was a screw supercharger.

Turbochargers use the "spent" or combusted exhaust gases to push a turbine which in turn (no pun int.) spins a compressor that forces air into the intake of an engine. This causes alot of heat because of the exhaust gasses being hot already. You need to have custom headers made to attach the turbo to, and then another custom pipe to vent those exhaust gases known as the downpipe. Then you still need pipe to bring the air into the engine, and you might need a intercooleer to cool the air charge otherwise you will have detonation and poor performance.

A centrifugal supercharge is technically a turbocharger, but it doesnt have a turbine to spin the compressor. Instead it has a shaft that spins the compressor when the belt of the crank/alt spins. This is how it gets similar power to a turbo, but maintains less heat because its being driven by metal, and not hot gasses.

The roots/screw type of superchargers are the ones you see from comptech, its basically a metal box with a compressor in it that is also spun by the crank/alt belt. It has two (or more) fins that spin to compress the air and force air into the engine without getting excessivly hot like a turbo. But its also expensive since the shaft is in a closed case with oil and must be perfectly balanced so it doesnt cause any vibrations when rotating on the inside. And its not as easy to fix/replace as would be a supercharger.

Let me go real vaugely into the pros and cons of each supercharger vs. turbocharger.


Traditional Compressor/Turbine Turbocharger (Prototype/HKS made the only documented turbo I know about for the 6th gen v6) of course there are many other people out there running turbos, but they are all custom made, and anytime you hear custom.. think $$$$

Pros: Flexibility with sizes and power levels for all types of cars. Parts readily available. More power are similar boost compared to superchargers.
Cons: Excessive heat, requires alot of plumbing to run tubes, and lines for the turbo. Can be dangerous if excess gasses arent vented properly, requires more maintenance than supercharger. This will also requier custom exhaust flanges, and piping.


Centrifigul Supercharger

Pros: Cost of parts are more affordable compared to other superchargers, the compressed air can be cooler than most other superchargers out there, produce better high end power than most other superchargers.

Screw Supercharger

Pros: Can produced alot of boost, and is great for larger vehicles that need more torque.
Cons: Cost more than a centrifigul, and doesnt really have a good high end power curve.

Roots Supercharger (I think this is what jackson racing, and comptech used for their supercharger designs)

Pros: I think this produces the best low end power of all the superchargers mentioned, and it will continue all throughout the high rpm range.
Cons: This runs the most hot compared to all the other superchargers at the same boost level, this also will be the most costly.

a good site to start at is www.howstuffworks.com or read some technical books about turbochargers (they have some at libraries, and alot at most good bookstores).

another thing I would do is learn how to weld, I always wanted to learn how to weld so I could do my own custom turbo setup one day. The best thing is having enough knowledge to do anything yourself. You really dont have to be all that handy to design your own turbo, you just need to know the theory.

Yes... even enginerd's can put together a turbo if they have the theory down, and measure their boost curve/map, and know how to check for boost leaks, and compression issues.

Also some other import things anytime you go Forced Induction, you should always consider upgrading your fuel system to match your compressors level. And also to make sure your car isnt over heating. Switching to a colder range spark plug is also very important, you gotta make sure the car can handle all that excess heat.

Hondas are one of my most favorite cars to turbo/supercharge because of its ability to make great power. Oh... then there is that small problem with our trannies.

before I bore you all to death (get it? bore? TEEHEE), let me stop. I may just clean this up and make this into a new thread. Because I am sure there are many people who still dont know the differance between the two. Hell I didnt even talk about turbo lag, spooling, compression, boost spikes, intercoolers, venting gases, bov's and wastegates... hahah I am here all night folks

For practicallity I would wait for comptech to see what they will release, if you drive a 6speed accord, then I would spend 7grand on a custom turbo that you know will get you into the 12's at least. And maybe another grand on a full port and polish job. Holy crap, I am starting to ramble.

~Abe
August 10th, 2004 08:51 PM
SteVTEC
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redman6986
The Turbo is more efficient when compared to a supercharger because it is using the exaust gases to turn the turbine while the supercharger uses the motor itself. NOS will only give you a boost for a little bit. Personally i think i would go with the turbo because the new turbos spool up so quickly there is very little "turbo lag."
It depends on what type of turbo it is vs the displacement and rev capabilities of your engine, and what sort of powerband and peak power target you're trying to achieve. If you want lots of top-end peak horsepower you most certainly will have a lot of lag because that requires a larger turbo which is more difficult to spool up. Lag free turbos are smaller turbos which spool easily, but you tradeoff top-end power. Smaller turbos have less capacity, and can't hold boost at higher RPM's since you start to run them out of their efficiency range.

Likewise, there are similar issues with superchargers also. There are different types: roots, centrifugal, and one other type. Some are great for top-end, others give you lots of power right off the line. I forget which is which, though. The Stillen S/C for the Maxima doesn't give much boost below 4000 rpm. On the otherhand, the setup on the Grand Prix GTP gives TONS of boost in the low-end and mid-range but drops off up top.
August 10th, 2004 07:32 PM
jiggerman78 Not only is it more efficent its also more upgradeable than a supercharger.But at the same time more expensive
August 10th, 2004 06:47 PM
Redman6986 The Turbo is more efficient when compared to a supercharger because it is using the exaust gases to turn the turbine while the supercharger uses the motor itself. NOS will only give you a boost for a little bit. Personally i think i would go with the turbo because the new turbos spool up so quickly there is very little "turbo lag."
August 7th, 2004 12:02 PM
albaughrsx turbo, supercharged keep dreaming for right now. i see no signs of anyone building anything only talk.
August 6th, 2004 10:18 PM
JPAccord id say if they promise it at the beginning of next year, expect it at the end, or early the next year.
August 6th, 2004 07:46 PM
brex sorry for being so scartistic... when do u think you will get any of them?
August 6th, 2004 06:55 PM
tx03coupe
Quote:
Originally Posted by brex
Couple of months?
lol, i'm getting the supercharger and j-pipe at the same time! hey i might as well throw in the aem crank pulley! i'm just a little bit angry...
August 6th, 2004 04:19 AM
brex
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiggerman78
You can ruin your engine if you dont know what your doing with nitrous and i think it might be a tiny bit expensive to get a new J30A1 engine. Just wait a couple of months until Comptech comes out a supercharger
Couple of months?
August 6th, 2004 04:00 AM
Plumaccordcoupe
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiggerman78
You can ruin your engine if you dont know what your doing with nitrous and i think it might be a tiny bit expensive to get a new J30A1 engine. Just wait a couple of months until Comptech comes out a supercharger
J30A4



August 5th, 2004 09:28 PM
SteVTEC and here's a 236 reply thread at AutoWeek. Print it out and read it while you're on the throne for the next week and you'll be an expert. There's some really bright people on that forum.

http://chat.autoweek.com/showthread....&threadid=7233
August 5th, 2004 09:21 PM
SteVTEC you guys need to learn to walk before you can go run a marathon.

Here's a good article I found on Google in about 2 seconds

http://www.automotivearticles.com/Su...charger_.shtml
August 5th, 2004 09:07 PM
JPAccord I def wouldnt go for any of the above if you think a s/c will make the sound of a turbo. Just stick to bolt-ons (intake, exhaust, headers, etc.) or visual mods. You should really learn a bout the inner workings, risks, and any other basic information regarding forced induction or any major power adding mods. How old are you, btw?
August 5th, 2004 05:35 PM
SpeedRacer
Quote:
Originally Posted by ferrari0266
i never seem a supercharge car, i wonder will it make any sound just like the sound from BOV on turbo
Ummmm....WOW. I'm at a loss for words here. I think I just lost some brain cells.
August 5th, 2004 05:31 PM
ferrari0266 i never seem a supercharge car, i wonder will it make any sound just like the sound from BOV on turbo
August 5th, 2004 10:42 AM
rocks03accord go with the s/c and for the neon lights i have them on my car and i have no trouble with cops and its really easy to do. so go for it.
August 5th, 2004 10:30 AM
jiggerman78 You can ruin your engine if you dont know what your doing with nitrous and i think it might be a tiny bit expensive to get a new J30A1 engine. Just wait a couple of months until Comptech comes out a supercharger
August 5th, 2004 09:20 AM
SpeedRacer I can tell by the way you're talking you really don't know much at all about automotive performance. You need to do a LOT of reading and research on general performance and how turbos, superchargers and nitrous work before you even THINK of putting a power adder on your car. Just because you can afford it doesn't mean you're ready for it.
August 5th, 2004 07:23 AM
JPAccord If only a s/c would come out...
August 5th, 2004 02:02 AM
Plumaccordcoupe
Quote:
Originally Posted by abram2001
I dont know who said that its not good to turbocharge/supercharge these engines... but they surely need a kick in da head.




August 5th, 2004 02:01 AM
i3igpete
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiggerman78
well lets c they dont make a turbo and their coming out with a supercharger. If you wana spend 7g's on a turbo feel free stick 2 nitrous even though i h8 it.
whoa EASY! EASY! EEEEZZZZZ!
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