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Old May 27th, 2003, 11:42 PM   #1
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I'm still here

I joined this site with a 2001 TW Accord EX V6 coupe... then my dad got a G35 Coupe a couple months ago which left his poor old 2001 black A6 2.7T Quattro sitting around, so I claimed it as my car, and used the accord occasionally. a couple weeks ago my accord was sold and I miss it. I bid farewell to this site, but let everyone know that I would still be around because of my dad's car. Yesterday May 26th I got a 2003 white Camry SE V6...not too shabby. heh. so I'm still here and haven't driven anything buy V6s. so I guess I'll be here more often once again.

one question. is the my camry 210hp 220tq? edmunds.com says differently. thanks
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Old May 28th, 2003, 02:46 AM   #2
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Look under the hood and if the engine says VVT-i on it you have 210HP
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Old May 28th, 2003, 08:50 AM   #3
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If you JUST got the Camry V6 then you probably have the VVT-i engine. Edmunds has two listings for the V6 cars since this is a mid-year change.

Pop the hood. Post up some pics too


The VVT-i V6 also comes with a 5spd automatic vs the old 4spd auto.
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Old May 29th, 2003, 12:14 AM   #4
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I think I have 4spd auto with overdrive
but I think it says VVT-i under the hood
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Old May 29th, 2003, 12:25 AM   #5
 
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wow you got a camry now. you should've kept the A6, that car was pimpin. Are you thinking of doing mod's to the camry?
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Old May 29th, 2003, 12:44 AM   #6
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Originally posted by aznpnoy562 on May 28th, 2003 at 11:25 PM

wow you got a camry now. you should've kept the A6, that car was pimpin. Are you thinking of doing mod's to the camry?
maybe just springs and rims and some bulbs here and there

I would like to keep the A6, but my dad wanted cheaper payments so he got me the camry

hows the intake and headlights btw?
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Old May 29th, 2003, 12:55 AM   #7
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anyone know how many exhaust resonators I have? is it worth taking them out? I want a deeper exhaust note, but not loud
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Old May 29th, 2003, 01:13 AM   #8
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yay! vvt-i power!
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Old May 29th, 2003, 01:13 AM   #9
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also should I get a muffler or no muffler?
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Old May 29th, 2003, 01:17 AM   #10
 
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Sad to see you sell the Accord .

The Camry V6 with vvt-i should help you get over that though .



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Old May 29th, 2003, 01:21 AM   #11
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I want to properly break it in, so itz still on the slow side and boring side and not liking very much side, but itz getting there. I took it thru a canyon today to help it out a bit
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Old May 29th, 2003, 01:24 AM   #12
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another thing, I got SE for the black housed headlights and the stock strut bar, heh. one thing I dont like is the stock front grill, so does anyone wanna make me a nice black mesh one? $$$
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Old May 29th, 2003, 02:26 AM   #13
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does my intake system have the butterfly valve like the new celicas? if so, anyone know how to remove it?
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Old May 30th, 2003, 04:54 AM   #14
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Do you mean a variable intake manifold? If so, you wouldn't want to remove it.

As for the exhaust, I'm pretty sure the Camry comes with a dual-stage muffler that keeps it quiet in the low-end and switches over to a high-flow setting at high revs. It's kinda like Nissans Variable Capacity Muffler which helps preserve the low-end while keeping it freer-flowing in the high-end. So it'll probably hurt the performance if you replace it with a regular, single-mode muffler.

BTW, how is the Camry, anyway? I bet it feels a whole lot stronger in the low-end than your Accord.
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Old May 31st, 2003, 01:11 AM   #15
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haven't really pushed it yet, but from what I've experienced so far, it feels stronger

anyone else have any other view on the exhaust resonator and muffler thing?

and the butterfly valve?
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Old May 31st, 2003, 07:51 AM   #16
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I don't think Toyota uses variable capacity mufflers. I think only Nissan uses those.

The 1MZ-FE has a variable intake manifold of some sort, but you'd have to find some pics of the engine ripped apart to see it, or find a parts diagram.

Also, be sure to run premium gas in that engine. We have the same engine in our Highlander (w/twin throttle bodys) and it definitely picks up a good amount of power and torque with higher octane gas.
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Old May 31st, 2003, 01:15 PM   #17
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I'm pretty sure the Camry has a dual-mode muffler. I remember reading about it in a Car&Driver road test article. The RX300 and Highlander have it as well.
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Old June 1st, 2003, 12:31 AM   #18
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for the intake butterfly valve thing... in a celica its in the intake tubing somewhere and when its removed it gives better throttle response, and my cousin says there's one in the camry... but my cousin doesn't know what hes talking about most of the time so... IS THERE ONE?'


also.. can u find the article about the exhaust/camry? or at least tell me what issue its in?
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Old June 1st, 2003, 07:20 AM   #19
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Oh, you're talking about tumbler valves.

Tumbler valves are little half-moon shaped plates that halfway block your intake manifold runners which creates turbulence and helps promote a better mixture and a more complete burn. It's for emissions and to a lesser extent fuel mileage.

I have these on my 99 Maxima (Cali-spec emissions) and supposedly they're only open below 3000rpm and only when the car is cold. Otherwise they're open and not getting in the way. No anamolies show up on dynos.

I wouldn't be surprised if the 1MZ-FE has one. Our Highlander is a bit soft below about 2700 rpm, but just above that it seems to get a sudden burst of extra torque which is characteristic of these tumbler valves. The Mazda 6s also has one that's set at 2700 rpm. If you feel any sudden bumps in the torque curve then it's probably a tumbler. If it's a smoother and slower transition then it could be the variable intake manifold (if it has one.)
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Old June 1st, 2003, 10:49 AM   #20
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Does the AV6 have a tumbler valve since it's designed to be an LEV? I swear that I feel a little extra push when I hit 3000rpm although dynos show that the AV6 actually has less torque at 3000 than at 2000-2500. I mainly feel it when accelerating in 1st gear though I can feel it in 2nd and 3rd, just not as much.

As for the Camry road test, it's in the October 2001 issue of Car&Driver. Here's a few quotes about the mechanical features:

"...the intake manifold has low- and high-speed chambers to enhance the torque curve."

"Iridium-tipped spark plugs are good for 120,000 miles, which is the length of the emissions warranty."

"Both engines get mufflers that switch to low back-pressure in high-flow situations."

That is one well-equipped engine. It has a variable intake manifold, a dual-mode muffler, VVT-i(at least on the new ones), and Iridium plugs. It's too bad Honda can't do that
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Old June 4th, 2003, 03:06 AM   #21
 
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Originally posted by TH23 on June 1st, 2003 at 12:49 PM

That is one well-equipped engine. It has a variable intake manifold, a dual-mode muffler, VVT-i(at least on the new ones), and Iridium plugs. It's too bad Honda can't do that
Honda doesn't need to on the 7th gen . They were able to do it without all of that. Since the7th gen AV6 has 2 mufflers it which silence the exhaust it doesn't need the duel mode muffler.

Though it wouldn't hurt if Honda threw on a variable intake manifold (for more torque) and Iridium plugs .

And the duel mode muffler was dropped on the 2004 Maxima since they put duel exhaust.



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Old June 4th, 2003, 01:33 PM   #22
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Honda did do a pretty good job on the J30A4, especially in the high-end but it still lacks the mid-range punch of the VQ30DE-K and 1MZ-FE. Those two engines use a variable intake manifold and variable capacity muffler which seem to be two of the best features for making a broad torque band. It is impressive that the J30A4 bests them both in high-rpm output using only regular fuel I can't wait to see the dyno results for the Type S cams. I'm really hoping that those are the J30A1's ticket to being almost as strong in the low-end as the VQ30DE and 1MZ-FE. I've got my fingers crossed.
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Old June 4th, 2003, 04:21 PM   #23
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Originally posted by TH23 on June 1st, 2003 at 12:49 PM

Does the AV6 have a tumbler valve since it's designed to be an LEV?
Yes. Technically. "Tumbler valve" on the J30A1 is called "VTEC-E camshafts"

One intake valve operation below 3500 rpm enhances swirl which improves fuel atomization and cleaner burning. At the expense of power.

Quote:
I swear that I feel a little extra push when I hit 3000rpm although dynos show that the AV6 actually has less torque at 3000 than at 2000-2500. I mainly feel it when accelerating in 1st gear though I can feel it in 2nd and 3rd, just not as much.
It's probably an effect from the torque converter because the automatic dyno does in fact show more torque at 3000rpm than at 2000rpm.

Quote:
As for the Camry road test, it's in the October 2001 issue of Car&Driver. Here's a few quotes about the mechanical features:

"...the intake manifold has low- and high-speed chambers to enhance the torque curve."

"Iridium-tipped spark plugs are good for 120,000 miles, which is the length of the emissions warranty."

"Both engines get mufflers that switch to low back-pressure in high-flow situations."
Sweet!

Quote:
That is one well-equipped engine. It has a variable intake manifold, a dual-mode muffler, VVT-i(at least on the new ones), and Iridium plugs. It's too bad Honda can't do that
Honda *can* do that, but they choose to only put the good stuff on the much more expensive Acura products.
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Old June 4th, 2003, 05:35 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by SteVTEC on June 4th, 2003 at 06:21 PM

Yes. Technically. "Tumbler valve" on the J30A1 is called "VTEC-E camshafts"

One intake valve operation below 3500 rpm enhances swirl which improves fuel atomization and cleaner burning. At the expense of power.
That's why I'm hoping the Type S cams help relieve the J30A1's lack of low-end because I'm sick of you knocking my car. BTW, since the Type S cams will eliminate the swirl effect, do you think an add-on like the Helix will help make up for it? I'm ASSuming that because the stock cams create the swirl effect, the Helix can't help much, but with the Type S cams its full effect could be realized. What do you think?

Quote:

It's probably an effect from the torque converter because the automatic dyno does in fact show more torque at 3000rpm than at 2000rpm.
Oh okay. That makes sense. The TC does a lot more than I once thought it did. It also makes since that the engine would make more torque at 2000 than 3000 due to the stock cam's lack of airflow which better suits lower engine speeds.


Quote:
Sweet!
The Highlander has that feature as well so if you feel a change in thrust in the high-end, then you'll know it's the muffler valve


Quote:
Honda *can* do that, but they choose to only put the good stuff on the much more expensive Acura products.
Yea, my Acura had a three stage variable induction system and I thought it was the greatest thing ever. I could feel and hear the manifold change as revs rose. Heck, I think even the Prelude had a variable manifold back in the late '80s but Honda refused to give the Accord one a decade later. Honda's so worried about saving money. I remember reading what a Honda engineer said way back in 1997: "We could have gotten 215HP out of the engine(J30A1) on premium fuel, but we decided that our customers wouldn't want to spend extra money on fuel for 15HP" He said something to that effect but that extra 15HP could have made a big difference. Another mistake made by Honda is that damn robot but I'm not going to get into that.

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Old June 4th, 2003, 07:19 PM   #25
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Originally posted by TH23 on June 4th, 2003 at 07:35 PM

That's why I'm hoping the Type S cams help relieve the J30A1's lack of low-end because I'm sick of you knocking my car:laugh :
I'm not knocking your car.

I am creating demand for aftermarket parts.

Quote:
BTW, since the Type S cams will eliminate the swirl effect, do you think an add-on like the Helix will help make up for it? I'm ASSuming that because the stock cams create the swirl effect, the Helix can't help much, but with the Type S cams its full effect could be realized. What do you think?
The Type-S cams still have a swirl effect because they stagger the intake valve openings. And I still have yet to see any dyno evidence on the J30A1 for this Helix mod.

Quote:
The Highlander has that feature as well so if you feel a change in thrust in the high-end, then you'll know it's the muffler valve: )
It also has dual throttle bodies.

There is some sort of transition right around 3000rpm on our Highlander. Dunno what it is, but a variable muffler usually isn't something that you feel so it's probably the variable intake manifold. But that sucker has so much torque that there's really no need for anything beyond 3500-4000rpm 99% of the time, so I haven't extensively butt-dyno tested the top-end. I did hookup my OBD-II scanner to it and did some runs last weekend though - just haven't gotten around to looking at them.


Quote:
Yea, my Acura had a three stage variable induction system and I thought it was the greatest thing ever. I could feel and hear the manifold change as revs rose. Heck, I think even the Prelude had a variable manifold back in the late '80s but Honda refused to give the Accord one a decade later. Honda's so worried about saving money.
In 1992 the Maxima SE had both variable valve timing *and* a variable intake manifold.

Yup, it's all about the bottom line.

I think Honda's mentality is...if the customer doesn't know what it is, we're not going to give it to them...unless the car absolutely can't get by without it.



Quote:
I remember reading what a Honda engineer said way back in 1997: "We could have gotten 215HP out of the engine(J30A1) on premium fuel, but we decided that our customers wouldn't want to spend extra money on fuel for 15HP" :rolleyes : He said something to that effect but that extra 15HP could have made a big difference.
And the asinine thing is that Honda could have done this for dirt cheap.

- Specify higher compression 10.0:1 pistons (free, you're just specifying different pistons)
- Add knock sensor ($50 per car I bet)
- Add closed loop timing control to ECU (FREE, recycle old code from C-series engines)



But hey, at the time the Maxima had "only" 190 HP, and the Camry had "only" 194 HP, so what does Honda care? They beat them both with a mighty 200 HP all on regular fuel and without more advanced engine managment so why bother? Nevermind the fact that the engine had so little torque that it still gets owned overall by both. But the customer doesn't know what torque is, and horsepower is what sells cars (not torque) so why bother?












Quote:
Another mistake made by Honda is that damn robot but I'm not going to get into that.:rant2 :
What the heck is all this robot talk about?
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Old June 5th, 2003, 02:30 PM   #26
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by SteVTEC on June 4th, 2003 at 09:19 PM

Quote:
I'm not knocking your car.

I am creating demand for aftermarket parts.
Okay, I'll believe you

Quote:
The Type-S cams still have a swirl effect because they stagger the intake valve openings. And I still have yet to see any dyno evidence on the J30A1 for this Helix mod.
Oh, I get it now. No matter how small the difference is, as long as a difference between the timing and lift of the intake valves exists, so will the swirl effect. When AEM tested Toby's car for the V2 they also dynoed his car with and without the Helix. They found that the Helix added a small amount of power throughout the range and 3whp peak. That was with each intake, including the stock airbox. Not much for $80, but from what I've read, the noise it makes is worth it.


Quote:
It also has dual throttle bodies.
I'm jealous. What really blows my mind is that the M3 and 760Li have one for each cylinder

Quote:
There is some sort of transition right around 3000rpm on our Highlander. Dunno what it is, but a variable muffler usually isn't something that you feel so it's probably the variable intake manifold. But that sucker has so much torque that there's really no need for anything beyond 3500-4000rpm 99% of the time, so I haven't extensively butt-dyno tested the top-end. I did hookup my OBD-II scanner to it and did some runs last weekend though - just haven't gotten around to looking at them.
Hmmm...I thought the intake manifold changed over later on the 1MZ-FE but maybe that was just the Camry. Maybe it switches over sooner on the Highlander due to the extra weight and the need for more torque compared to the Camry. I wish the Accord had enough torque to not need to be revved beyond 3500. In fact just last night, I was challenged by a 5-speed base Ford Focus with the meager 110HP engine. That little sucker was right next to me from idle to 3500 when VTEC finally kicked in and I was able to blow away from it.

Quote:
In 1992 the Maxima SE had both variable valve timing *and* a variable intake manifold.
Nissan kicked ass back in the late '80s and early '90s. I remember the 2nd gen Maxima had the adjustable suspension that you could choose between soft, normal, and sport. No other car in its class had that back then but then Nissan ditched it on the 3rd gen Max. What's funny is that Lexus put that on the last-gen ES back in 1997 and acted like it was something special. I wonder if they were aware that the Maxima had that feature a decade earlier?

Quote:
Yup, it's all about the bottom line.

I think Honda's mentality is...if the customer doesn't know what it is, we're not going to give it to them...unless the car absolutely can't get by without it.

And the asinine thing is that Honda could have done this for dirt cheap.

- Specify higher compression 10.0:1 pistons (free, you're just specifying different pistons)
- Add knock sensor ($50 per car I bet)
- Add closed loop timing control to ECU (FREE, recycle old code from C-series engines)

But hey, at the time the Maxima had "only" 190 HP, and the Camry had "only" 194 HP, so what does Honda care? They beat them both with a mighty 200 HP all on regular fuel and without more advanced engine managment so why bother? Nevermind the fact that the engine had so little torque that it still gets owned overall by both. But the customer doesn't know what torque is, and horsepower is what sells cars (not torque) so why bother?


I know, that kills me Honda is smart, but in a bad way. They feed on the fact that so many people believe that Honda is the king of the automotive world and that they can't do anything wrong . Unfortunately, I'm one of those people. I fell victim to Honda's tricks. They're getting better about it though, look at the 7th-gen. I guess stiffer competition than ever has driven them to. It's inappropriate to half-ass an already undersized engine when the competition is running around with 3.5L V6s under their hoods.


Quote:
What the heck is all this robot talk about?
You know how a lot of people have been saying that Honda's quality has declined over the last several years? Well I have a theory that Honda's slip has been caused by that damn ASIMO robot. It makes sense. It has been under development for the last 15 years and Honda has invested millions of dollars into it. Those millions have undoubtedly come out of their automobile R&D budget each year therefore causing their quality to fall.
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Old July 3rd, 2003, 02:50 PM   #27
 
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i have a 98 auto camry le v6 (pre-vvti)

1)your camry should have 1 cat, 1 resonator, 1 muffler. however the camry's exhaust system is flawed significantly due to the fact that the exhaust system has to go under and around the rear strut suspension unit. this causes a significant loss in power because the exhuast gas has a very big interruption in its path. you can see it if you get down behind the car. also, i would not recommend removing your resonator without changing your muffler (i suggest the TRD one btw) because ive heard numerous stories of bad effects as a result of doing so.

2) yeah yeah, vvt-i is the shizzle. BUT you cant add a supercharger to your camry.

3)i got a great DIY for your intake if youre not willing to spend $200 for a short ram Injen intake. unfortunately, injen is the only company that makes an intake for the v6 camry and a CAI does not exist. WHY? because our camry does not have a path in which the CAI can exist in the first place. our current stock intake setup actually gets its air from behind the driver side head lamp. take out the air box if you dont believe me. lol.... it would require extensive work to make your own CAI. sooo the DIY i have is basically a modified stock air intake setup. i will add pictures if i have a chance later. but for now words will do:

a)first of all get a K&N or TRD air filter and get rid of the stock paper crap they put in there.
b) safetly jack up your car in the front driver side or put it on a lift and take off the front driver side wheel.
c) toyota engineers finally did something smart and decided to use the same size bolt for almost all of the bolts in the car... its 10mm btw. get a 10mm wrench or ratchet and a philips screwdriver. now you gotta unscrew and unbolt your fenderwall splashguard. be careful, you need to take out your mudguard if you have one on first. also, you will need to remove around 10 screws/bolts from the fenderwell and to the front bumper (the splashguards extends to the underside of the middle of the front bumper). make sure you dont lose any of the clips and make sure you remember how the splashguard fits into the car body
d) if you sit parallel to the car, facing foward next to your drivers door, you should see this white container that sort of looks like a milk jug. its inside the fenderwell in the front. but its huge so you should be able to see it from like 10 miles away. haha guess what it is? a airtomb! a resonator! in other words, a waste of space (performance-wise speaking)! get your 10mm piece and take that thing out of there! there are 2 bolts.
e)get some duct tape and seal up the exposed hole from the plastic tubing that originally lead to the airtomb/resonator. i tried looking for a rubber cap but its in the shape of an oval so i had no luck.
f) put everything back. dont forget anything.

4) throttle response on the camry is garbage. its like a benz. i dunno why but its most likely the family-car-tuned auto tranny controlling everything. you floor the accelerator and there is around a two second lag before you feel the RUSH, hear the engine REV, and see the tachometer EXPLODE. turning off the overdrive helps a little bit but if you really want some instantaneous throttle response, shift to the lowest gear possible. i decided to take a drive around the neighborhood, testing out each of the gears. from a standstill, first gear is the way to go if you want to smoke your tires and get that instantaneous throttle response. now this isnt some chirping, im talking about a cloud of smoke. be careful when doing this..haha.

i hope this all helped.
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Old July 3rd, 2003, 03:00 PM   #28
 
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lol i forgot something

with all this extra torque and small disparity in horsepower, shouldnt the camry sprint to 60 faster than the accord v6? camry was tested at 8.2 and accord at 7.5 by car and driver. its mad trippy because the camry sure feels faster than the accord. maybe its that camry magic toyota uses to make you feel like youre going faster than you really are.
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Old July 3rd, 2003, 07:13 PM   #29
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btw... u know my camry is different from yours right? different Gen...
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Old July 4th, 2003, 04:43 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by ricerokets4life on July 3rd, 2003 at 05:00 PM

lol i forgot something

with all this extra torque and small disparity in horsepower, shouldnt the camry sprint to 60 faster than the accord v6? camry was tested at 8.2 and accord at 7.5 by car and driver. its mad trippy because the camry sure feels faster than the accord. maybe its that camry magic toyota uses to make you feel like youre going faster than you really are.
I'm pretty sure most of it has to do with the transmission because the Camry is stronger until 5250rpm. The Accord's tranny shifts fast and rough which helps make it pretty quick 0-60. The Camry's tranny shifts a bit slower and much smoother from what I've heard. Also, the Accord has slightly shorter gearing in 2nd and 3rd gear. Just because the Accord has a quicker 0-60 time doesn't mean it will win the race. The Camry puts some distance on the Accord early on and even with the quicker 0-60 time the Accord is playing catch-up. Even at the quartermile, the Camry is still slightly ahead and only at around 115mph does the Accord catch up only to be left again when 4th gear comes around.
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